destroyers !

[id-]

question: What do you need to win a human on GW? :whistling
ud: 8 ghouls, nerubian, spirit tower, dk+lich with orb + MASS DESSI + MASS HARASS. :rofl:

[Infernal]

Gyrosss!!!!

[BlAdEmAsTeR01]

errr... tier 2 push before tier 3 as well as gyros!!!

[id-]

hf rushing udbase with nerub, spirit and graveyard up.

[Vex.Marquise]

fast expo at t2 and either rifle up or hawk up.. hawk is easier. Snipe the lich when u have lvl 2 or 3 bolt and pally .. remember to mass those towers if u hawk up

[Pro_Bush_Joe]

if you expanded, get tanks, but if he goes mass destros i guess gyros+rifles are your only option, destros really are a pain for humans, i know i have a lot of trouble with it

[XxNinjaxX]

see ShreiK replays vs UD

[kangaroo]

how is 8 ghouls going to let ud survive a tier2 push?

[unsinn]

if only it was so easy... :/

[Occult]

alot of shriek replays suck because he towers up and mass tanks which is boring and lame, though some of his others are good.

[Sinthesis]

question: What do you need to win a human on GW?
ud: 8 ghouls, nerubian, spirit tower, dk+lich with orb + MASS DESSI + MASS HARASS.
u should try it with some UD solo games (playing as UD). Its not that easy to micro ghouls to surround I guess.

But if you want advice (assumign thats ur purpose of thread), then its important take advantage of the large map and expand where the UD wouldn't think u have. Don't spend too much gold on towers, just push rifles + priests and harrass.

[Neon.HoLiDaY]

gyros

[NOSKILLNUKE]

turtle like a turtle and masssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss gyros from 4 factories while creeping new expos with your heroes only. the most immmmmmmmba strat ever, but imba UD deserves it. give them a lil dose of no-skill

[Hacker]

m4ss gyros + tanks, and dont go for 4 factories :S
2 are enough as gyros pump very fast, just upgrade their flak cannon!

[oprahjimfrey]

I dont know why more people do not go tanks against destroyers. Maybe because it is tier 3 and that can be a little bit inconvenient. But Tanks are pretty effective against destroyers, and + they make excellent offensive weapons when you assault a UD base or expansion!

[Xequecal]

Start keep upgrade, then expand. They can't stop your expansion because footmen are much stronger than ghouls and you have elementals. Harass them and don't let them expand until destroyers start morphing. Again, this should be easy with elementals. Upgrade masonry, put 12 guardtowers in your mainbase and 16 guardtowers at your expansion. Upgrade iron plating and gunpowder as well. Start Castle ASAP, erect multiple Workshops. At this point you should just hide in your base behind towers, creeping if you get an opportunity. Now mass gyrocopters, their destroyers will just melt, and they won't be able to get enough fiends to menace you before you have 48+ gyros with bombs that will just destroy all their buildings.

If you can micro really well, go MK first instead of AM. Bolt+surround their DK when it comes to harass. Get Paladin second and buy staves of sanctuary. Now hero nuke is useless against you and they can't even go fiends against you because of how effective MK/Paladin are in killing them.

[stevey]

Start keep upgrade, then expand. They can't stop your expansion because footmen are much stronger than ghouls and you have elementals. Harass them and don't let them expand until destroyers start morphing. Again, this should be easy with elementals. Upgrade masonry, put 12 guardtowers in your mainbase and 16 guardtowers at your expansion. Upgrade iron plating and gunpowder as well. Start Castle ASAP, erect multiple Workshops. At this point you should just hide in your base behind towers, creeping if you get an opportunity. Now mass gyrocopters, their destroyers will just melt, and they won't be able to get enough fiends to menace you before you have 48+ gyros with bombs that will just destroy all their buildings.

If you can micro really well, go MK first instead of AM. Bolt+surround their DK when it comes to harass. Get Paladin second and buy staves of sanctuary. Now hero nuke is useless against you and they can't even go fiends against you because of how effective MK/Paladin are in killing them.

I'd genuinely rather lose than play like that.

Infact if I thought I could get level 50 by towering up like a bitch every game, and only level 40 by playing rifle caster, I'd still go rifle caster.

[Xequecal]

I'd genuinely rather lose than play like that.

Infact if I thought I could get level 50 by towering up like a bitch every game, and only level 40 by playing rifle caster, I'd still go rifle caster.

You can not beat Undead without towering up. It is simply impossible to get enough riflemen and healing scrolls out before the destroyers chainmorph and kill you. UD techs fast enough that you generally only have 2-3 minutes after reaching Keep before 10-12 ghouls and 3-8 (yes, if they skip Lich and CL they can hit you with 8 dests.) full mana destroyers come and kill you. No army you can possibly put together by that time will be able to fight this off.

[LeavePlz]

You can not beat Undead without towering up. It is simply impossible to get enough riflemen and healing scrolls out before the destroyers chainmorph and kill you. UD techs fast enough that you generally only have 2-3 minutes after reaching Keep before 10-12 ghouls and 3-8 (yes, if they skip Lich and CL they can hit you with 8 dests.) full mana destroyers come and kill you. No army you can possibly put together by that time will be able to fight this off.

8 destroyers when the human player hits teir 2??? never seen that happen. for future reference destroyers require tier 3 and an upgrade at tier 3 to be able to morph. Unless u left the UD player alone the entire game then there never gonna have 8 destroyers with full mana as soon as u get Keep. Its just unheard of.

[Radientfury]

towers are very innefective versus destros. The towers get destroyed in seconds and then the dk just heals the one destro that was getting focused. ALot of wasted resources. Just make a sanctum and a workshop at teir two, get preists and gyros, But your main focus should be the riflemen. Either that or you can get some mortar teams instead and rush him at tier two, chances are he wont have the destroyer form upgrade yet. Mortars are for the towers.

[nightfall-]

CLOSE THIS THREAD THERE ARE ABOUT 1 MILLION CLoNES OF IT WTF STOP THIS SHIT ABOUT DESTRO AND CYCLONE

ok now i can /caps off

[Xequecal]

towers are very innefective versus destros. The towers get destroyed in seconds and then the dk just heals the one destro that was getting focused. ALot of wasted resources. Just make a sanctum and a workshop at teir two, get preists and gyros, But your main focus should be the riflemen. Either that or you can get some mortar teams instead and rush him at tier two, chances are he wont have the destroyer form upgrade yet. Mortars are for the towers.

That's why you have to build tons of them. 12 towers will shoot down a Destroyer in two volleys.

Trying to go rifle/caster against destroyers is futile. It requires way too much lumber and too many upgrades, you will die before you can get them all. Workshop can't even be considered because of the ridiculous lumber costs. You need two 140 lumber sanctums, a 125 lumber range upgrade, riflemen for 30 lumber each. You also need to upgrade adept training for priests so your riflemen don't get owned by mass skels, that's 50 more lumber. The units and upgrades also take way too damn long to build, 45 seconds for adept training where that sanctum can't produce units.

Even if you do manage all these upgrades, that means you don't have an expansion and the UD is probably going to win anyway due to the fact that they can easily snipe units all game with coil/nova, harass expansions to death with the unkillable destroyers, and just win via attrition. Gyrocopters are useless without flak cannons and it's simply impossible to reach Tier 3 Workshop units without towering up because of all the lumber required. You need 150 lumber for the Workshops, 150 lumber for the flak cannons upgrade and then 30 lumber per gyrocopter.

[Basic.Icecream]

You lose vs UD regardless, you expand, he counter expos + mass tower. Not hard to tell if HU is going Rifle/Caster or not. UD with same amount of gold mines > HU.

[LeavePlz]

That's why you have to build tons of them. 12 towers will shoot down a Destroyer in two volleys.

Trying to go rifle/caster against destroyers is futile. It requires way too much lumber and too many upgrades, you will die before you can get them all. Workshop can't even be considered because of the ridiculous lumber costs. You need two 140 lumber sanctums, a 125 lumber range upgrade, riflemen for 30 lumber each. You also need to upgrade adept training for priests so your riflemen don't get owned by mass skels, that's 50 more lumber. The units and upgrades also take way too damn long to build, 45 seconds for adept training where that sanctum can't produce units.

Even if you do manage all these upgrades, that means you don't have an expansion and the UD is probably going to win anyway due to the fact that they can easily snipe units all game with coil/nova, harass expansions to death with the unkillable destroyers, and just win via attrition. Gyrocopters are useless without flak cannons and it's simply impossible to reach Tier 3 Workshop units without towering up because of all the lumber required. You need 150 lumber for the Workshops, 150 lumber for the flak cannons upgrade and then 30 lumber per gyrocopter.

you should really stop playing the game because you just mentioned every counter to UD and said it was useless which is not the case. I'll agree that human is very very weak vs UD but a human player can win if u arent constantly thinking about the things that wont work during the game. Also, where is the UD player gonna get mass skellies? Only way thats gonna happen is necrowagon which means he wont have destroyers. It takes like 4 priests to stop a necrowagon.

[Basic.Icecream]

you should really stop playing the game because you just mentioned every counter to UD and said it was useless which is not the case. I'll agree that human is very very weak vs UD but a human player can win if u arent constantly thinking about the things that wont work during the game. Also, where is the UD player gonna get mass skellies? Only way thats gonna happen is necrowagon which means he wont have destroyers. It takes like 4 priests to stop a necrowagon.



You sir, are not smart at all. 4 Adept Priest aren't gonna stop diddley squat.

[LeavePlz]

lol...if u play the game often u would know that necs go down in like 2 seconds meaning as soon as u dispel the skeletons it leaves the necs wide open to an attk. Unless he goes fiend/necrowagon then all u gotta do is have gryphs cuz necs arnet gonna be able to stop a well microed army. If necs could beat high level players easily and consistently then people would use them every game(apparently thats not the case considering 85% of UD players dont use casters on a regular basis). Every opinion somebody has, you say it cant be done and that it doesnt work...thats just a sign of a bad player. If you think nothing works then you're gonna lose thats just how it is. Why even play if u know you're gonna lose?

[Basic.Icecream]

I used to play this game often, and I know how the game works. I've been playing since RoC, and I've faced off against old school gosus like Assasin before. I play enough to know how TFT plays, so please stop trying to insult my skill just because I say something doesn't work. To completely stop an all out Necrowagon army you would need at least 6+ master priests, mortar teams with shells, and something to meatshield you, and AoE spells.

[undead-bebop]

Necrowagon doesnt work very well against HU mainly because this tech would slow down the UD tech alot more than otherwise. The HU can simply expand then go to the UD base and pressure, put up 2 aviaries and just pump gryphons and 3-4 priests to rape the skellies/necros.



It works alright vs an MK first HU if you managed to slow him down alot during tier 1. Otherwise I really wouldnt recommend it.

[LeavePlz]

to be honest with you, it really doesnt matter. this thread is way off topic so it needs to be closed regardless of how people feel.

[Xequecal]

You lose vs UD regardless, you expand, he counter expos + mass tower. Not hard to tell if HU is going Rifle/Caster or not. UD with same amount of gold mines > HU.

How does he counter expand? You have a huge advantage over him before Destroyers come out, footmen are much stronger than ghouls. You start your expansion, and then go prevent him from putting one up until his destroyers start morphing. He can expand at this point if he wants, you'll still win as it's far too late. 100/100 in 3/3 gryphons and gyrocopters will beat ANY UD army, even fiends because of storm hammers.


you should really stop playing the game because you just mentioned every counter to UD and said it was useless which is not the case. I'll agree that human is very very weak vs UD but a human player can win if u arent constantly thinking about the things that wont work during the game. Also, where is the UD player gonna get mass skellies? Only way thats gonna happen is necrowagon which means he wont have destroyers. It takes like 4 priests to stop a necrowagon.

Three heroes with necro wands will create so many skeletons that your riflemen get massacred if you don't have adept priests to dispel them. Also, I didn't say everything was useless. Expand + mass tower works very well vs. UD.

[id-]

How does he counter expand? all he really needs to do, is to keep destroyers coming and run in between my main base and expansion. avoiding my main army... slowly hit&running a rifle down, a priest down, a tower down and it wont take long that he has the needed amount of destroyers to push any defendless, but towered base down. you simply have not enough resources to keep up with this strategy. and so is the expansion is countered. :giljotiin

[Basic.Icecream]

How does he counter expand? You have a huge advantage over him before Destroyers come out, footmen are much stronger than ghouls. You start your expansion, and then go prevent him from putting one up until his destroyers start morphing. He can expand at this point if he wants, you'll still win as it's far too late. 100/100 in 3/3 gryphons and gyrocopters will beat ANY UD army, even fiends because of storm hammers.



Three heroes with necro wands will create so many skeletons that your riflemen get massacred if you don't have adept priests to dispel them. Also, I didn't say everything was useless. Expand + mass tower works very well vs. UD.



AMS Fiends > Gryphs, and we all know Fiends owns Gyros.


Your an idiot, UD tier2 rock HU tier2 with no casters. Since you expo, and I counter expo, all we have are AM/MK/Foot and DK/Lich/Ghoul, I outnumber, and I have more nukes to use. You will lose every tier 2 battle without casters.

[Xequecal]

AMS Fiends > Gryphs, and we all know Fiends owns Gyros.


Your an idiot, UD tier2 rock HU tier2 with no casters. Since you expo, and I counter expo, all we have are AM/MK/Foot and DK/Lich/Ghoul, I outnumber, and I have more nukes to use. You will lose every tier 2 battle without casters.

.....no it doesn't. You have better units, and elementals. Level 2 elementals at Tier 2. There is no way UD is beating your footmen and elementals with only non-frenzy ghouls and no dispel. Maybe if you suck and they're able to nuke your AM to death, but otherwise no.

Also, banshees? Who the hell builds banshees? I've never seen a UD make them. Your gyrocopters with siege damage can kill them easily anyway.

all he really needs to do, is to keep destroyers coming and run in between my main base and expansion. avoiding my main army... slowly hit&running a rifle down, a priest down, a tower down and it wont take long that he has the needed amount of destroyers to push any defendless, but towered base down. you simply have not enough resources to keep up with this strategy. and so is the expansion is countered.

If you have 12 guard towers with level 2 masonry, there is no "hit and run" on them by destroyers. 12 towers kill a destroyer in two volleys and have longer range, you can't micro them out and you'll lose at least one just getting into range.

How do I "not have enough resources?" I have double his resources. Riflemen? I don't build many, nor do I build casters at all. 12-20 towers at main and expo easily repels any UD army. He can't make both meat wagons and destroyers on one base. Once he has destroyers out, he can of course start an expansion that I can't stop, but mine has been up for much longer. If he expands, that gives me the time I need to set up my army. A 100/100 Human Tier 3 army beats anything UD has.

[id-]

"If you have 12 guard towers with level 2 masonry, there is no "hit and run" on them by destroyers."
why only 12 towers? lets build 24 while we're at it. :dancing:

[undead-bebop]

why only 12 towers? lets build 24 while we're at it. :dancing:

Not unheard of.