The anti-wraith band thread.

[Deafinator]

The most useless item ever.

Remove please.

[p2L-IntrepiD]

Not so sure about that... I have seen an sa who got early 5 bands and treads and was owning pretty hard early game. He went on to replace with S&Y and bfly.

[riotoblivion]

lol. i think defiantor means its imba. not useless. ok imo its not as useful as headdress bassilius and buckler :)

[AvengerxZ]

No, he means useless and he's more or less correct if you ask me. For their cost they are a waste of gold seeing as all agility gets you is additional damage and some attack speed. They offer no form of survivability outside of the very small amount of health added from the +3 strength and some armor. If you are going to buy any of the three main stat items you should stick with bracers or nulls if you are really in need of mana. Wraith bands are teh suck. Avengerxz OUT!

[Deafinator]

No, he means useless and he's more or less correct if you ask me. For their cost they are a waste of gold seeing as all agility gets you is additional damage and some attack speed. They offer no form of survivability outside of the very small amount of health added from the +3 strength and some armor. If you are going to buy any of the three main stat items you should stick with bracers or nulls if you are really in need of mana. Wraith bands are teh suck. Avengerxz OUT!
I usually get 2 bracers with agi that have low hp like siren, otherwise it would be 4-5 circs.

[Mandos.]

bracers are nice the added hp helps a lot when playing as an agil hero.

[mr psycho]

Yeah agreed, wraiths are crap. I get a couple occasionally if I'm using AM or SA, but that's about it.

[sir_icemaster]

No these are not useless. Sometimes I have 4-5 wraiths with power treads, and I'm pretty much owning early game. Then I sell them one by one in order to get higher items.

[eazo]

lower price maybe cuz i think that wraith bands are the most exspensive out of the three (i think)

[p2L-IntrepiD]

They all cost the same:
150 for the +3 item
185 for circlet
175 for the upgrade

all of them cost 510

[Proj]

I use em heavily :D in almost every game i have 1-2

[Raven.Icon]

I totally agree. Its suppose to help on attack/armour. But the effects are so minimal that its better to spend that money on some descent items.

2 wraith bands cost 1000 gold roughly, when u can get hand of midas for just 14000 gold and it not only increases ur attack speed but also u can use its ability to farm better, which is really great for agility heros early to mid game. I usually sell it later for butterfly.

I tend to go straight for boots to preserverence or just the ring of hp. If i buy chicken, i go w/ bracer/nulls.

[vahgar]

no way..i get 3 of them on an Anti Mage till lvl 10 he can get 1st blood with mana void and 4 blinks..u need that extra mana boost

[AvengerxZ]

You're spending 1530 gold for 117 mana. If you want mana it's not the right item to get. If you want attack speed it's not the right item to get. If you want damage it's not the right item to get. It's just not the right item to get.

[vahgar]

well..nothing else gives me hero killing at that cost so early..

[AvengerxZ]

I'll post an anti-mage replay and try and open your eyes to a more effective build order. If it works for you you should keep doing it but I find them terribly ineffective.

[vahgar]

still waiting for a techies build+replay from you..!

edit: I have never played with AM before..saw Cygnus play using this wraith band so well, he insipired me too play as he does.. Cygnus more replays from u! :happy:

[AvengerxZ]

Ohhhh... techies build.

Skill Build


Land Mines
Stats
Land Mines
Stats
Land Mines
Remote Mines
Lane Mines
Stats
Stats
Stats
Remotes
Stasis Traps
Stasis Traps
Stasis Traps
Stasis Traps
Remotes


I try to focus on farming in the early game by using land mines to kill creeps. Putting a level two land mine next to a range creep will net you two kills if there is a weak melee creep. I prefer this over planting tons of traps because it is next to impossible to effectively farm with techie's damage at low levels. Stats helps keep my mana up early game. Item build is generally composed of some of the following items:

Item Build

Eul's Scepter of Divinity - A must have for Techie's. You need the disable to effectively escape from gank situations and keep your mana up. This also allows you to get finishing blows on heroes by throw them up in the air, planting a land or remote mine and detonating once they fall to the ground.
Guinsoo's Scythe of Vyse - You have to get this after Eul's is used up. Isn't as good for escaping and setting up kills but has better mana regeneration and total mana increase. Hex makes you semi-effective in team fights as well.
Manta Style - Manta style may not seem like the best item in the world but it can still be very effective. When coupled with Guinsoo's your images can put out decent damage against heroes and towers. With proper use of stasis traps and land mines you can push towers and kill heroes very quickly using this item.
Linken's Sphere - Good for the spell block to escape ganks and awesome mana regeneration / stats. Don't buy this item right off the bat because you need more mana regeneration and this takes too long to farm up.
Necronomicon - Don't get this often but can be used to push towers and kill heroes.


You can mix that up if you want but those are the items I find worthwhile for techies. I don't get a chance to play him very often because I random most of the time but one of these days I'll try and post a replay. :)

Edit: And lol @ Cygnus comment. I'm in the process of helping him learn a good anti-mage build ^^. Infact, two nights ago he had a revelation why wraith bands are a shitty item for him.

[vahgar]

ZOMG where is suicide??!(see sig!) Thats the funnest skill I want to exploit and take out like 2-3 heros for a double/mega kill after weaking them with mines! Can you gimme a build+replay with mine+suicide use if possible?

Agree with items, assuming ur only mentioning the high level items....what abt the low lvl stages..? But wont Manta be better with Anti Mage as more mana burn+with AM's own mana break..?

ps: are u the guy who when dota 1st began I got replays from..u were just a member here and now a staff gg ^.^ rem ur clan sumo..rocked!

[AvengerxZ]

Yes, that is I. I'll be posting more replays once the new CAL season starts but for now it's alot of pubbing and no good replays comes out of that. I'm against the use of suicide because I view it as a pretty lame spell. I know, it's in the game and should be used but it gimps you as a hero because you don't get expereince from the heroes you kill when you suicide. Low level item is Eul's scepter. If you farm using land mines you can get it very quickly. I forgot to mention boots of travel, too. Always get boots of travel on techies. It allows him to farm every lane and defend with ease. Manta style is bad for anti-mage because it over rides his passive mana break. Manta style burns half the mana so you are really gimping yourself. There is an exception to this rule, however, in which if you purchase manta style before putting any points into mana break you can get the mana break from your ability and still use the mirror image from the item. Note that if you move manta style around in your inventory or drop it then you will again only burn 32 mana per hit.

[Gladiator]

I gotta disagree with you avenger :[ .
Suicide is pretty much a must with techies. I don't use it a whole lot, but I think that you do need the first 2 points into it, and then you get stats later, for 2 main reasons
1) Assuming you're in mid with an ally, your initial suicide basically gaurantees a first blood and a huge advantage for your ally; he gets an extra level or so.
2) Eventually, lets face it, you're going to die, it's pretty much unavoidable. Might as well suicide to avoid giving them the kill, and maybe even hurt him a lot, too.

So I dunno, but those two points seem to do a crapload. Not to mention it just scares the bejeezus out of people trying to gank you.

That being said, wraith bands suck.

[AvengerxZ]

I know it's scary and I know it's good for your allies but I still have to say it fits into my category of lameness. People can use it all they want but it's the only skill I know of that has a 100% chance to kill yourself and deny the enemy experience and gold, not to mention the fact it does a retarded amount of damage.

[Gladiator]

I'd consider it lame if techies in general wasn't countered so easily. But, well, to each his own.

[Lee-volution]

I think suiciding with Techies is art in motion in a sense, haha. Basically yes, I think it's pretty lame for a Techies to mass suicide, but you can be able to maneuver yourself so well early game with that, getting multiple kills in 1 suicide skillfully. There are a lot of things that are lame, so I just consider this another one of them. I mean it doesn't take long before it doesn't have much of an effect anymore except denying experience on yourself.

[gismodog]

I get wraith bands on exactly 0 heroes.

[x)o(x]

actually the reason you see people going 3 wraith bands on am is because of the premium anti mage guide on dota-allstars. he has like 3 different builds but mostly recommends the hunter build, = treads and 3 wraith bands. it does work well, with an attack of 18 at 1500 gold plus the little extra benefits its easy to see why.

[Proj]

Imagine 2 same heroes fighting each other with the same skill, equip one of them with a wraithband, Who will win? After 1 kill i think the wraithband was worth its money. :)

[catfish]

but that wraith band is not going to get you that kill, your hero/skills are. It isn't going to make enough of an affect to save your skin 99% of the time. moreover for the money there are items (nulls/bracers) that are going to do a lot more to save your skin and get you the kill for the same money.

[simiwizard]

i think its an okay early game item on naga siren

[oLp]

I always get 2-3 Wraith Bands on AM. It really helps early game hero killing and the 18% ias, +18 damage, +armor, +hp, and +mana are really useful for blink and feedback.
Wraith bands aren't for every hero, but saying they suck is pretty dumb.

[Communication]

I always get 2-3 Wraith Bands on AM. It really helps early game hero killing and the 18% ias, +18 damage, +armor, +hp, and +mana are really useful for blink and feedback.
Wraith bands aren't for every hero, but saying they suck is pretty dumb.


the point is wraith bands give crappy gold to effect ratio compared to its buddies, Null Talisman and Bracer

[doob10163]

3 silppers give more attack speed and damage than a wraith band and cost less...

Why do you people get the wraith band anyways? I've noticed that people getting these bands get multiples of them.

Instead of 2 wraith bands you can get....

Animal Courier, flasks, clarity pots, sobimask/ring of brasilus, ring of regen, ring of health, void stone... and the almighty observor ward.

Not to mention that the only people I see using wraithbands are pubbers.

Please post why you get this crap item and I will rebut it (not saying "i put wraith bands on character X and owned with it)

[water-walker]

3 silppers give more attack speed and damage than a wraith band and cost less...

Why do you people get the wraith band anyways? I've noticed that people getting these bands get multiples of them.

Instead of 2 wraith bands you can get....

Animal Courier, flasks, clarity pots, sobimask/ring of brasilus, ring of regen, ring of health, void stone... and the almighty observor ward.

Not to mention that the only people I see using wraithbands are pubbers.

Please post why you get this crap item and I will rebut it (not saying "i put wraith bands on character X and owned with it)


DUDE!!! u beat me to it, i was gonna say the exact same thing as u! Seriosly, getting 3 slippers + a bracer give exactly as much agility as two bracers, more health, a little less mana, for a cheaper cost. Wraith bands arent good, because agility heroes blume later in the game, where wraith bands are an early game item, making them have no synenergy with an agility hero.

[damptraktor]

Useless on every hero except SA.

[mroZoZrout]

need more mana buy mantle in iteligence
need more Hp buy guntleet of ogrey strenght
need more agi wtf xD rofl

its useless to to transmute them coz its little bit expensive and u will old them in late game (and if u need that things- u are low lvl so udont have many items and thx 2 this u dont care about inv.space)
5*3=10strength and its enough 5*150=650gold
5*6=30 strength wow 5*150+185*5+175*5(recipie dont know)=2550 hmm quite expensive


need more hp with agi. hero buy gountleet no wrait. in some situations can be null + bracers suitable but i dont make them ( better to buy gauntleet + matle and get exact same bonus and save cca 200 gold)

thx no re N00bs

[Eternal Soul]

Wraith bands do help some heros such as sa, am, and other agil heros that need a little str boost with some agil

[damptraktor]

Why in gods name would you need bands on AM?

He has good base agi and attackspeed, most of the damage comes from the manaburn- he also has one of the lowest base hps in the game, so why in gods name would you want +3 dmg over 57hp?

The only reason they are good on SA is because they are +12 dmg with level 4 backstab.

[ZadiZz]

Wraith bands doesn't suck imo. Im not a pub player and get wraith bands on alot of heros. On venge or drow wich have aura. With 2-3 wraiths you get huge damage capacity early game with the aura.

Usually my am build is a ror 3 wraiths and treads and a basher. Unless they got alot of nukers skip the shield. Then you will have around +28agi +18strenght +18intel at lvl 14. And if you had solo lane this are cheap items to get if you didnt farm much, still they will own as much when you start hunting. For me it's not about going for the big items at once but build up and I dont feel it's necessary with a bracer or null atleast on antimage as he has blink , and shield if vs huge amount of intel.

[damptraktor]

drow/vs - somewhat agree, but both of those heroes also have really crap hp and should use bracers instead. I'm pretty sure most of you people are braindamaged when you value +9 dmg over almost 200hp (3 bracers vs bands).

[mroZoZrout]

drow/vs - somewhat agree, but both of those heroes also have really crap hp and should use bracers instead. I'm pretty sure most of you people are braindamaged when you value +9 dmg over almost 200hp (3 bracers vs bands).


my words dude :rofl:

[ZadiZz]

most of us people are braindamaged ? yeah sure. with drow venge I would always get wraith instead of bracers unless it is a cw since then the scourge team will hold of mostly aoe nukers. on a inhouse game I would always go for wraith since the auras increase the damage around 30% and they stack with eachother. you can easily get +60 - 70 damage when you have your aura maxed out. If you play careful and not get gangbanged (usually you would die in a gangbang even if you have wraiths or bracers) and know how to handle being low hp it wont be a problem at all. If your afraid to die just get lothars.

[mroZoZrout]

most of us people are braindamaged ? yeah sure. with drow venge I would always get wraith instead of bracers unless it is a cw since then the scourge team will hold of mostly aoe nukers. on a inhouse game I would always go for wraith since the auras increase the damage around 30% and they stack with eachother. you can easily get +60 - 70 damage when you have your aura maxed out. If you play careful and not get gangbanged (usually you would die in a gangbang even if you have wraiths or bracers) and know how to handle being low hp it wont be a problem at all. If your afraid to die just get lothars.

if u are not afraid of dieing why buy wraith. U can invest gold better. :curious:

[ZadiZz]

Cause it gives you the best overall boost to agi heros. On drow you can use a lill more mana for silence and on venge for stun/swap. Then you say why would you go wraths if you want bigger manapool ? Cause of the benefits it gives agi heros especially drow/venge . But offcourse it all depends how long you can hold the lane and how good you farm. Being on solo lane and you farmed good you could go for a bow.

[N!Jr]

Like heores, no items are useless but getting a bracer or a null seems like a better option