WCReplays.com Community Forums
 

Go Back   WCReplays.com Community Forums > Warcraft Forums > Warcraft III Strategy

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
Unread 05-18-2012, 01:03 PM   #81
griffer
Staff
 
griffer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 2,643
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Noobs_Gone_Wild View Post
No they dont. Piercing does 150% to unarmored, 200% to light armor. Gargs are unarmored same as dryads.
Oh yeah gargs and hippos break the armor rule lol, sorry. The part about attack rate still applies though.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by nelfandmeisimba
Now tediously microing units with sophisticated mechanics is quite another thing, and is why I'll always enjoy WC3's micro emphasized game play more so than SC2's accountant like game play.
griffer is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-18-2012, 01:10 PM   #82
justbritto
600 Point Level
 
justbritto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Alice Springs, Australia
Posts: 637
Default

^Yeah. Their non-poison dps is weak.

Like I said, 1/3 of dryad damage is poison, so for dryads it's more like 167% vs light armour and 133% vs unarmored. Also, unlike gargs, hawks are very tanky. With animal war training, they're like flying grunts. Getting close to double the hp of gargs. So they're actually about as good at fighting dryads as gargs, if not better. When you factor in all of the above, gargs still have slightly more ehp/food and slightly more dps/food than hawks when fighting dryads, and they have their stone form tricks... but there's no substitute for the hawks' pure tankiness when there's heroes around.

Last edited by justbritto; 05-18-2012 at 01:28 PM.
justbritto is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-18-2012, 01:30 PM   #83
Sacred Reich
Out of here!
 
Sacred Reich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: London
Posts: 934
Default

I don't know what's worse, the amount of theorycraft leaking from certain people's posts or the fact that its this thread again.
Sacred Reich is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-18-2012, 02:11 PM   #84
justbritto
600 Point Level
 
justbritto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Alice Springs, Australia
Posts: 637
Default

^lol. Sorry. I can't help it. I am and always will be a staunch defender of pallies, alchemists, bloodmages, copters, hawks and footies, wherever they are denigrated or oppressed.

Last edited by justbritto; 05-18-2012 at 02:44 PM.
justbritto is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-18-2012, 03:44 PM   #85
4Fun
1500 Point Level
 
4Fun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,947
Default

hawks are terrible because elf will always have a panda which rapes the shit out of hawks regardless if they have better health or not than gargs, gargs can regenerate their health with their statue form.
__________________
When you look into an abyss, the abyss also looks into you. ~Friedrich Nietzche

.Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution. ~Theodosius Dobzhansky

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinthesis View Post
This could mean the human genome is now back to 50% complete.
lol
4Fun is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-18-2012, 06:31 PM   #86
The-Noobinator
800 Point Level
 
The-Noobinator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 821
Default

These threads always end up with people bitching on how their race sucks and how every other race should be nerfed.
The-Noobinator is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-18-2012, 07:08 PM   #87
taiwwa
50 Point Level
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 69
Default

Tauren Chieftan shockwave should disorient enemies much like slam.
taiwwa is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-18-2012, 07:10 PM   #88
taiwwa
50 Point Level
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 69
Default

Destroyers should have 200 less HP. being magic immune flying unit + healable by death coil is very OP.
taiwwa is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-19-2012, 01:27 AM   #89
justbritto
600 Point Level
 
justbritto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Alice Springs, Australia
Posts: 637
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 4Fun View Post
hawks are terrible because elf will always have a panda which rapes the shit out of hawks regardless if they have better health or not than gargs, gargs can regenerate their health with their statue form.
This is a good point.
justbritto is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-19-2012, 06:25 AM   #90
Infernal
700 Point Level
 
Infernal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Stockholm!
Posts: 762
Default

there are lots of good points here... yet you still insist hawks are good vs elf lolol

show me ONE replay of a progamer going hawks on a tavern map vs elf and winning please!
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by ex0duz
I know i said i wouldn't respond since i know your game of drowning in walls of text and ignoring facts, so i'll keep this short and sweet so it's obvious for everyone to see and so that there's no confusion here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Myers
After notice this terrible actor was choosen play Sabretooth choose the worst charac.
Infernal is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-19-2012, 07:02 AM   #91
justbritto
600 Point Level
 
justbritto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Alice Springs, Australia
Posts: 637
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Infernal View Post
there are lots of good points here... yet you still insist hawks are good vs elf lolol

show me ONE replay of a progamer going hawks on a tavern map vs elf and winning please!
And winning? lol. No. I can't. I haven't seen one where the hu wins. It's hard. I never pretended otherwise. But for that matter, hu vs ne is always hard. Hawks are just the best of a bad bunch, imo.
justbritto is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-19-2012, 07:26 AM   #92
Infernal
700 Point Level
 
Infernal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Stockholm!
Posts: 762
Default

so hawks are the best available option, yet there's not a single game of hawks winning. Wouldn't that mean HU would never win vs elf? im sorry but youre not making very much sense
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by ex0duz
I know i said i wouldn't respond since i know your game of drowning in walls of text and ignoring facts, so i'll keep this short and sweet so it's obvious for everyone to see and so that there's no confusion here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Myers
After notice this terrible actor was choosen play Sabretooth choose the worst charac.
Infernal is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-19-2012, 09:11 AM   #93
WhenPeonsAttack
Accounts Coordinator
Mad-eye
 
WhenPeonsAttack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 3,030
Default

Actually, I can think of a few games of hawks winning for sky on ei. Let me do a quick search:

http://w3g.replays.net/doc/cn/2012-1...875076096.html

http://w3g.replays.net/doc/cn/2011-1...568760771.html

http://w3g.replays.net/doc/cn/2011-1...528817321.html

and a loss vs moon:

http://w3g.replays.net/doc/cn/2011-6...784771733.html

and I'm sure there are other games, maybe even him winning vs remind/moon/soccer. But Una and Tu_Xie are both very good, don't know about box.

But yeah, I'm pretty sure they are more reactionary units and probably not used at all the way Justbritto is describing them.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Megoydagi View Post
THIS IS FOR WHENPEONSATTACK

listen bro, peons looking like ashit so i picked the blademaster
WhenPeonsAttack is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-19-2012, 09:28 AM   #94
Sacred Reich
Out of here!
 
Sacred Reich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: London
Posts: 934
Default

Even so, all these proposed changes and theory-crafting are for 1v1 solo. When are you guys going to realise that 1v1 is dead and won't ever be patched? The game is 100% balanced at 2v2 and tbh I can't think of any changes for UD with respect to 2v2 even though I'm a UD sympathizer.
Sacred Reich is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-19-2012, 02:47 PM   #95
justbritto
600 Point Level
 
justbritto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Alice Springs, Australia
Posts: 637
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WhenPeonsAttack View Post
Cheers wpa.

I haven't watched the first 2 yet, cos I don't have evercraft/etc atm. But this game illustrates the power of hawks vs lore builds perfectly well. I'd say it's only opportunistic in the sense that hu had a strong early game. The ne is arguably outmatched, but it's still a good example. Don't forget the premise: hu needs equality of xp and gold, and appropriate heroes... which virtually requires outmatching the ne.

Last edited by justbritto; 05-19-2012 at 02:58 PM.
justbritto is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-21-2012, 12:51 AM   #96
Elite_Stealth
1000 Point Level
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: California
Posts: 1,230
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sacred Reich View Post
Even so, all these proposed changes and theory-crafting are for 1v1 solo. When are you guys going to realise that 1v1 is dead and won't ever be patched? The game is 100% balanced at 2v2 and tbh I can't think of any changes for UD with respect to 2v2 even though I'm a UD sympathizer.

Undead: "1v1 is broken and dead, 2v2 is completely balanced"

kinda makes sense through an undead perspective
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluedot View Post
Which of the hijackers wasn't Muslim?
Quote:
Originally Posted by LeavePlz View Post
The ones in the CIA
Elite_Stealth is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-21-2012, 06:43 AM   #97
Kiezel
1500 Point Level
 
Kiezel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 1,787
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vhapter View Post
NE vs HU and OR vs UD are the only matchups that could be more balanced in my opinion (well, maybe NE vs UD too, but I don't know how strong NE is in this matchup)
Undead dominates Nelf completely. By the SK statistics this matchup was the most imbalanced and even worse out of the 50% range then nelf dominated the orc in the dott time. For some reason however, people chose to ignore this and keep complaining about Nelf > Orc, instead of Ud > Nelf which was actually more out of balance. Only reason I can think off; is that there where more nelf vs orc matches/players, or that people just focused their attention more on the obvious cyclone, then the accumulation of all the small things ud has to dominate nelf.

Anyhow; if there is going to be a new patch:

Human:
- Reduce cloud size from Hawks.


Nelf:
- Anti magic potion can no longer be dispelled.
- Improve wellspring upgrade time.

Undead:
- Reduce frost breath to 5 seconds, down from 7.
- Give carrion swarm a damage cap, not a unit cap.

Orc:
- slightly decrease walker upgrade time.

Neutral:
- Give the Alchemist +1 starting armor.
- Fix fog-of-war drops with tinker factory.

Map:
- Fix where reallied units can run into the lab creeps on the 3 o'clock position on TM.
- Fix where reallied units can run into the lab creeps on the 12 o'clock position on GW.
- Fix where reallied units can run into the goldmine creeps on the mid-right position on tidewater.
- Add additional trees and/or move the red camps on GW to prevent them from attacking a player his base.
- Fix the green trolls camps on MV to be the same on both top and bottom spawn.

Bnet/Blizzard
- Update warden system to reduce hackers to 1%, down from 43%.
- Put at least 1 person on WC3 custom support, up from 0.
- Decrease bnet delay to 100 MS, down from 250 MS.
- Fix the AMM system.
- Fix the ELL system.
- Incase unable to join a game, give a rapid notification instead of being 'grayed out' for 2 minutes.
- Add command /showwhispers to show last X amount of received whispers from people.
- Make it unable te receive a loss when your score is =>15% then the one of your opponent (in RT?).
__________________
WC3 FPVoD
Kiezel is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-21-2012, 09:39 AM   #98
griffer
Staff
 
griffer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 2,643
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiezel View Post
Only reason I can think off; is that there where more nelf vs orc matches/players, or that people just focused their attention more on the obvious cyclone, then the accumulation of all the small things ud has to dominate nelf.
...
- Anti magic potion can no longer be dispelled.
- Improve wellspring upgrade time.

Undead:
- Reduce frost breath to 5 seconds, down from 7.
- Give carrion swarm a damage cap, not a unit cap.
Not that I disagree with you but... how are these changes relevant to NvU? Frost wyrms, dreadlords, and wellspring don't really matter in 90% of those matches. Could you elaborate more about what specifically in NvU is not balanced? Are ud units too powerful? The heroes? Or are ne units too weak? In what way?

Quote:
- Fix fog-of-war drops with tinker factory.
Huh?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by nelfandmeisimba
Now tediously microing units with sophisticated mechanics is quite another thing, and is why I'll always enjoy WC3's micro emphasized game play more so than SC2's accountant like game play.
griffer is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-21-2012, 09:40 AM   #99
eS_no.skiLL
Out of here!
 
eS_no.skiLL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 307
Default

remove blademaster from game
remove tztook from this forum
make shadow strike cost 65 mana
make dryad hp more
make giants cost 350 gold instead of 425
buff ne
nerf orc
nerf ud
thanks
eS_no.skiLL is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 05-21-2012, 10:01 AM   #100
eS_no.skiLL
Out of here!
 
eS_no.skiLL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 307
Default

the only reason i commented this trolling comment is becus people are obviously trolling and not serious when asking 3hp regeneration for blight
or 100 mana cost for shadow strike ( while deathcoil 75 )
or asking talon from 135 to 175.. blizzard will never ever make such huge patching, if they ever gonna raise a price of a unit up, it will be from 135 to 145 , thats it. also if anyone wants to comment, pls comment out of common sense and out of logical brain, i mean don't come and comment after u got raped by a player and put all your emotions in this forum.. either use ur brain and comment ( not your emotions ) , or dont comment at all.
eS_no.skiLL is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:43 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.