Hero Ideas and Suggestions

[Phreak]

Let me repeat this: This is not DOTA ALLSTARS. There are no +35 dmg, +30% IAS, 1000 damage Flamestrike items. NEVER!

Aside from that, it's a good thought, but those items would be too easy to get. I mean killing a level 6 hero is 3 wood to everyone? No thanks.

Maybe you can get hero upgrades from the secondary resource, but no spells or huge items.

[Nero.]

Also I agree with you about the damage increase and attack speed increase. RoC DotA was great because you could not kill a hero that was supposed to be a tank in like five hits. Also the lumber thing, where you can build towers in the place of enemy towers is just gravy, a very strategic addition to an AoS type game IMO. Also I do not think that you should be able to upgrade creep damage/armor because it would allow the teams to exploit creep skills to overcome the enemy creeps.

[Demongod86]

FSP, I would believe that would be the POINT. Ever played EotA? That game is all about upgrading your creeps. I don't care how godly your hero is, he won't change the outcome of the battle if he's armed with 10000 gold worth of items if the enemy's creeps can overrun six waves of yours. The fact is that if your team upgrades its creeps and the enemy doesn't, that's THEIR problem. And Phreak, keep in mind that I'm making the item stats off the top of my head, and the stats. And getting spells would be a nice addition. It would make playing the game over constantly more fun because you can change heroes all the time by the specials you give them. As I said, the secondary resource should be scarce but the rewards should be great. If the secondary resource only upgrades hero stats, people would just use it as a bonus. But if you could have many options with it, such as skills, items, hero upgrades, special structures, etc..., then you get where I'm going. The more strategy and complexity we can cram into every little nook and cranny of this game, the better. Why do you think EotA is as nice as it is?

[Nero.]

Did you even read my post

I said instead of damage and armor make creep skills be a winning factor...would make the game more intersting IMO, maybe a little to long but interesting none-the-less. Also do you remember the one version of Allstars where the creeps could be upgraded and have 80+ damage...ya...? ToB is one of the best AoS type maps out there and they do not have unit damage increase. They have spawn towers, which spawn stronger units. Let me make my last-last post more clear. Ok your in a game of "Phreak AoS" (ya..) and you build your caster spawnie tower. You chose the "Witch Docter" caster tower and they start with the default "Pin Ward" and you want "Healing Ward" so you go to your "Creep Shop" and buy the skill for your Witch Docters. Then you build your melee tower and you chose the "Knight" melee tower. These guys start with "Knights' Honor" but you also want "Knights' Vigilance" so you go to your "Creep Shop" and buy it. My point is damage and armor should not be everything for the sake of strategic values.

Now for a suggestion. Spawnie Towers. For my suggestion I think each side should have a choice of about 8 towers for three catergories, these catergories being: caster, melee, and siege. For example the caster towers would be, Witch Docter, Shaman, Banshee, Necromancer, DotT, DotC, Priest, and Sorceress or make up your own casters. Now each caster when spawned comes with one default skill and two "Shop" skills which you have to buy from the "Creep Shop". Melee and siege would also have eight units for a total of 24 units and 3 different towers. As for the bought skills each unit would have around 1-2 buyable skills from the shop for a total of 24-48 skills. IMO this could create some good combos and strategic outcomes.

THIS WHOLE POST IS A SUGGESTION

[Burner]

So, FSP, if that would work we would have to be able to control the creeps right? In order to cast their spells? It would add strategy but stray away from normal dota standards. (Thats not necessarily a bad thing)

it would be nice if they could make the creep A.I automatically cast those spells. Like a WD casts healing ward when allied units are in trouble for example.

[Nero.]

As far as I know creep A.I. can do this...if it can't then I guess scratch everything I just suggested -_-

[Quoth]

What about for killing hero towers/buildings, the teams get nothing? Just my opinion, but if a team takes down a tower or building, it gives them an advantage. It seems a bit unfair to give them another advantage for doing so, as it essentially means once you start to win, you are more likely to keep winning.

[Nero.]

Um, well if you kill a spawn tower that unit stops spawning...

[Phreak]

Interesting thoughts. I know AI will use basic spells, like Roar, Healing Ward, etc. As for buying them spells, well that's trigger work, so I can't guarantee that. I'm taking a liking to "kill tower = gain wood" for some kind of creep upgrade. One of the nice things about that is if you start winning one lane, other lanes may feel the effects, promoting teamwork is keeping what towers you have, in any lane, alive. I think putting up your own towers in the place of your opponent's towers is also good. Can work for a good anti-camping system, as you'll gain not only more units, but an additional wood benefit for placing an extra tower down.

I'm not sure if we need 24 additional spawnies or not, or even if I like the spawn tower idea...

Hmm, on second thought, killing one tower and then giving an advantage to the team that killed it gives a lot of edge to whoever can siege the fastest. I suppose it should be based off of actually putting a tower down there, spending a large chunk of gold, which will cement your advance, and then give you (or your team) a bit of wood to upgrade. The gold cost can be tweaked so that even if you kill the tower early, you won't be able to put up the tower till level 6+. Would allow the other team to gain ground back. The defending team I think could also be allowed to replace their tower for less cost, but of course no wood benefit. This would help them survive if they gained their ground back, and due to the placement of the towers, can stop sneak-suicides.

On a progress note, I haven't gotten anything done yet on hero creation, though ogre_bob has shown me one that he's done so far (one that wasn't suggested here). The terraining is mostly done though, it looks somewhat similar to the old TfG terrain (don't know if it's been changed).

[Ilovepandas]

Oh oh!!! I have a hero Idea:
Duffman! -Model = Pandaran Brewmaster or Arthas with Pandaran brewmaster voice.
Strength hero
Skills: Pelvic Thrust - Duffman Thrusts his hips at an enemy disgusting them deeply, causing damage and knocking them backwards.
Level 1- 75 damage, knocks unit back a small distance
Level 2- 150 damage, knocks unit back a small distance
Level 3- 225 damage, knocks unit back a medium distance
Level 4- 300 damage, knocks unit back a medium distance
Drink Beer - Drinks some beer, causing increased damage but reduced attack speed
Level 1- 20% enhanced damage, 5% attack speed reduction
Level 2- 40% enhanced damage, 10% attack speed reduction
Level 3- 60% enhanced damage, 15% attack speed reduction
Level 4- 80% enhanced damage, 20% attack speed reduction
Ripped(passive) - Duffman is ripped!! he has permanent strength enhancements
Level 1- 5 strength bonus
Level 2- 11 strength bonus
Level 3- 18 strength bonus
Level 4- 26 strength bonus
Ultimate - Streaking!! - Duffman rips of his clothing and runs naked, stunning every unit on the map for a few seconds while boosting Duffmans movement speed
Level 1- 1 second stun, 25 improved movement, lasts 3 seconds
Level 2- 2 second stun, 40 enhanced movement, lasts 5 seconds
Level 3- 3 second stun, 60 enhanced movement, lasts 7 seconds
Hope you like my idea, it will probably need nerfed though, Duffman is too gosu ^_^

[Demongod86]

Phreak, I still say you should be able to buy hero spells to turn the tides of battle, like chain mana burn, lightning fury (which will essentially call down bolts of lightning to hit enemy creeps/heroes, numbers can be worked), etcetera etcetera, I mean if you use your wood to get a spell instead of upgrading a whole multitutde of creeps or on a massive tower, I think the spell should make an equally drastic effect, don't you? Ditto with items. Just think of EotA. A dead enemy hero can equal A) new tower B) new upgrade C) new hero upgrade

Well now I want to add
D) New item
E) New spell.

It would add some more strategy to the game, as well as giving players more powerful heroes at their disposal, and we all know how everyone loves powerful heroes.

[Phreak]

Demongod: I am definitely not opposed to buying spells. I do feel however that they should go as items as opposed to taking another slot next to Attack, Move, Hold Position, etc, it helps to limit the super-hero aspect.

[Demongod86]

Well, if you're upgrading your hero instead of the creeps, I think you SHOULD get that super hero if your creeps aren't gonna be. Because frankly, a spell taking up an item slot would be quite unwieldy since you would have to look at that little mana cost symbol, click the item, etcetera. If the spell was built IN to an item, for example an orb of lightning that gave +15% attack speed and the ability to cast a level 3 chain lightning, that would be fine, but if it would be a "staff of [insert spell name here]" I am just thinking that there are probably many many items that would serve that item slot better, but there may not be. Really, it's my suggestions and your way of working them. I put in the idea, you twist it, mold it, and come out with a product.

But as for an item

Blade of the Demon Hunter
Gives +[insert appropriate damage value here], +[insert appropriate attack speed increase here], [insert approriate evasion amount here] and the ability to mana burn your opponents for [insert appropriate amount here] for [an appropriate mana cost here]. Also adds [insert proper amount of agility here]

[Nero.]

Are there gonna be recipes like Allstars or just items you buy? Also the 24 is the number of spawnies you get to choose from. You can only have 3 towers per lane, melee/caster/seige and the units spawned are dependent on what tower you chose to build.

[Zoltan]

i think whatever ur having better not be cheesy.

i just played this one game it was sooooo god damn cheesy it was pathetic. Like this guy could Fly (mount a wyvern) but everythign can still attack him and u lose part of ur atk and u can only use the cool spells when ur riding it. (like a footmen was swining air and it was hurting me like wtf!)

[Phreak]

FSP: I realize that, but does there really need to be 24 different extra spawns to choose from? :*). Still thinking about if it's to be implemented or not, I still really like the "build the tower, get wood" idea.

Keep suggesting items, yo!

[Nero.]

Well...someone said the more complex the better...so ya

Not sure if you answered this already but are you using recipes for items or will they be just single items? I wouldn't mind suggesting a few items

[Phreak]

Suggest items, not sure about recipes, it kinda leads to the "one uber-hero" concept.

[Demongod86]

I dunno, but if you're gonna have an item, theme it.

Let's try this one...

Sword of Storms
Artifact (aka decently expensive)
Increases attack speed by 50%, increases damage by [insert proper number], and allows the bearer to cast forked chain lightning (yes, that means 3 chain lightnings going off at once).

Shield of Night
Adds [insert an appropriate amount of armor here], 35% increased magic resistance, and grants the ability to shadowwalk at night (windwalk only during the night).

Gem of the Angel
Grants a +[insert proper amount of armor] devotion aura and the ability to call down heaven's light (a spell which targets ten times healing an appropriate moderate amount of damage each time...if this is used on one allied hero, it'll often heal from red to full), and +[insert proper amount of HP here]

Really up in the air here...these are very loose ideas but see if you can make something out of the concepts, phreak.

[Quoth]

Don't you think it might be a bit unfair to have an item that can heal a hero completely? Just my opinion, and obviously that wasn't set in stone, but it seems to lend itself to one hero dominating.